Hi guys, apologies.  I've been crazy busy at work.  Dalekoracle rightfully pointed out that I was guilty of dragging things off topic as much as anyone else.  As a moderator, I like to stay hands off as much as possible.  That said, when I realized that this wasn't some old, long established thread, I was going to move it to "Off Topic News" and encourage the natural flow of this thread.  But again, crazy busy at work.  So by the time I got around to it, it was moved already.  So rather than move it again, I'll just try to stay out of the way.  Have fun kids. 

You know I think I've pinpointed the exact moment when the left-hand door was first used.

When the show was first broadcast, the Police Box was familiar to the whole viewing public, probably since police films and TV shows set in London would have been shown across the whole of the UK, and dramatic moments would have had characters running for the nearest box to use the phone.  So the public knows full well what a Police Box is, and what it looks like.  Hence the use of a familiar but incongruous spaceship on the show.

But do they know which doors open? Outside London & Glasgow, probably not, since most drama probably only showed someone using the phone, not going into the box.  However, Londoners would most likely know, and the BBC production crew, while not all being Londoners, worked and maybe lived in London, because that's where Doctor Who was made. So they're all familiar with the Police Box too, and make a pretty good effort at making it authentic (even down to the opened windows in "Worlds End").

Now I've not watched a few Hartnell stories, but what I have seen has always had characters entering and leaving the ship through the right door (which the Doctor obviously opens with a key). At no point is the left door used, and I would think this is because a) it would show too much of the inside and b) you'd have the odd Londoner writing into the BBC pointing out how inaccurate it was.  I'm not up on Troughton stories either but I've a feeling the same is true, everyone looks out of and uses the single door.

Now we get to the 70s, and Pertwee's still using one door...until 1973 and "Three Doctors". 

Right at the end of Episode 1, the Doctor runs out to confront the "gell bridge" and Jo runs after him...and the left-hand door is open and swinging. I think they needed that extra space for the drama of the scene - the doorway has to be wider to allow for the action.  That kind of breaks the unspoken rule that the TARDIS only has one door, and from then onwards it's Two-Door-City whenever the plot (or the action) requires it.

Of course if someone can point out a Troughton or Hartnell story where both doors are used, then my theory doesn't hold water.  Come to think of it, isn't there a Pertwee episode where he drives Bessie out of the TARDIS?  I've re-watched most of Pertwee, and I have a feeling it's in Season 7, but I can't remember which story it is.  He'd certainly need both doors open for that, but I kind of remember it was viewed from the side (much like the motorbike cop scene in the TVM, so the doors wouldn't have been visible.  I'm off to watch The Silurians now.

Quote from: lorisarvendu on Jun 23, 2018, 09:46 am
Come to think of it, isn't there a Pertwee episode where he drives Bessie out of the TARDIS?  I've re-watched most of Pertwee, and I have a feeling it's in Season 7, but I can't remember which story it is.  He'd certainly need both doors open for that, but I kind of remember it was viewed from the side (much like the motorbike cop scene in the TVM, so the doors wouldn't have been visible.  I'm off to watch The Silurians now.

No I don't think  there was ever a Bessie exiting scene BUT more importantly how the hell did he get the Console out in Inferno!   

I distinctly remember seeing it on TV sometime in the early 70s.  It was obviously done with split-screen.  I remember someone female standing by, watching as the car drove out, and always assumed it was Liz Shaw.  But now I'm wondering if it was Valerie Singleton and that it was actually on an episode of Blue Peter or something!

Not sure if anyone has mentioned this earlier but if I recall correctly, the actual first potential episode to use the left hand door is the Pilot when Barbara first enters the Tardis. Not sure if they changed it for the re-shoot.

Ah curses! My theory goes up in smoke.  I'm just watching Episode 3 of "Terror of the Autons" and the Doctor's walking towards the TARDIS...left-hand door wide open.  Back to the drawing board...

http://tardisbuilders.com/index.php?topic=7392.0

Quote from: petewilson on Jun 23, 2018, 10:27 am
...how the hell did he get the Console out in Inferno!  

I think the console may have already been outside the TARDIS by the time of "Inferno". The Doctor had it outside the TARDIS, and in a sort of combination sitting room/lab, in "Ambassadors Of Death", where he fiddled with it causing himself and Liz Shaw to alternately move a few seconds into the future, before catching up to each other. (Though they never showed or explained how he got it outside then either.)

Dino.

We've seen the console do short hops through time by itself; perhaps it can also do short hops through space...
or maybe he did what we have to do - take it through in pieces...

Not to mention Day of the Daleks

True, Marc. However since Pete (petewilson) had wondered how the Doctor got the console out of the TARDIS in "Inferno", I was looking for the earliest story where we see it outside of the TARDIS:

"Spearheads From Space", the 3rd Doctor's first story, and we only see the TARDIS from the outside; no interior scenes, and the Doctor never has time to fiddle with the TARDIS other than trying to take off;

Next came "Doctor Who And The Silurians" (the only story of the series to have "Doctor Who And" in the title); no TARDIS or console in that story; we see the Doctor tinkering with Bessie for the first time, and then getting right into it with the Brig and Silurians;

The next story is "Ambassadors Of Death" and the first time we see the console outside of the TARDIS, but no explanation of how it got outside is ever given.

That said, the "short hops" Crispin mentioned - which we did see in the final scene of "Inferno" (the next story and the last of Season 7) - show that the console on its own can travel short distances through space (and jump dimensions if its power source is mucked with) without the TARDIS. So this could explain the in-universe method the Doctor used to get the console outside of the TARDIS. (And of course, as Crispin also mentioned, the Doctor could have gotten it out in pieces, though I like Crispin's first suggestion better, and it makes for a more interesting and plausible explanation, and certainly it seems the easiest.)

And of course, we have the same question and plausible explanations in reverse later in the Pertwee era: how did he get the console back inside the TARDIS? I'm with Crispin's speculation on the console's short hop abilities for both.

Dino.

considering in "Inferno" at the end, the doctor asked the brigadier if he could have a couple of his men to help him with getting the console out of the dump he got stuck in. So ..... I'm thinking he did a short hop with it, as it has its own power banks, which would allow it to do this once disconnected from the Tardis. Then once he's finished work on it the same to get it back in.

What I don't get is: 1) Why take it out in the first place as there is plenty of room in the console room?
                          2) Why he didn't allow Liz in the Tardis nor took her on a trip in it?

Chris.

Quote from: Davros Skaro on Jun 25, 2018, 03:54 am
What I don't get is: 1) Why take it out in the first place as there is plenty of room in the console room?

Hypothetically speaking... Outside there was more room to have gadgets around the console while having comfy chairs and such to sit on when taking a break. (By that time the console room had no furniture in it anymore.)

Practically speaking... It was easier to film the Doctor tinkering with the console and the bits around it without having to continually cut between the console room set and the lab/sitting room sets, and they didn't have to set up the TARDIS prop in the lab/sitting room sets. Saved time and money.

Quote from: Davros Skaro on Jun 25, 2018, 03:54 am
                          2) Why he didn't allow Liz in the Tardis nor took her on a trip in it?

Hypothetically speaking... It could have been a resurgence of the 1st Doctor's desire to keep "Earthlings" out of the TARDIS. It was enough that the UNIT people knew something of what the TARDIS could do from the previous adventures (when he was the 2nd Doctor), but like an Area 51 scenario, the Doctor didn't want anyone getting inside the TARDIS and possibly trying to figure out how she worked, especially the military (i.e. UNIT). And there was no way the Doctor could have taken Liz (or anyone) for a trip in the TARDIS because, at that time, the TARDIS was not working at all.

Practically speaking... All of the Doctor's stories for Season 7 were set some distance from UNIT HQ (except for "Spearheads", which had half the story with the Doctor recovering from regenerating, and then for the other half jumping right into stopping the Autons), but they were all set on Earth in the "current" time for the 3rd Doctor's period. (Somewhat a repeat of this statement above, but augmented...) There was no way the Doctor could have taken Liz (or anyone) for a trip in the TARDIS because, at that time, the TARDIS was not working, and the plot device of having the Time Lords manipulating the TARDIS to transport the Doctor to where they needed him to intervene hadn't been thought up yet. There was also no real reason to have the TARDIS nearby on those stories (which is why no one went inside the TARDIS), but it did give the writers a chance to show the Doctor tinkering with the console even if he was away from the box and UNIT HQ.

I hope some of this makes sense.

Dino.

Also, the state of the TARDIS control room set wasn't great either by this point.  Eventually they did wind up doing stories that used the black & white photograph roundel wall and it works if the story is strong and the viewer is willing to suspend disbelief, but it isn't a particularly convincing look when shot in color.  The counsel is in terrible shape too, but there's really no way around that.  You've got to have something for the Doctor to run experiments on.