The Tom Yardley Jones TARDIS (Original) (1980)

[galacticprobe]

Hahaha, you're going to get even more confused now we know that Fivefingeredstyre and Volpone are both Steves!

Yeah... exactly what I thought when I saw "volpone" Steve's post. I was thinking of following suit with the dialogue from "Silence in the Library" regarding the two 'Dave's:

"Oh, well, Other Dave, because that's Proper Dave the pilot, he was the first Dave..."

In that sense, "fivefinteredstyre" Steve would be Proper Steve because he was the first, and "volpone" Steve would be Other Steve. I'll sort that one out when I get there... hopefully. Hopefully sort it out, I mean, not hopefully get there. That is, hopefully I'll get there and then hopefully get it sorted out.

Okay... I am now invoking the First Rule of Holes: "When you find yourself in one, stop digging!"

In all seriousness though, you're not the only one who is confused by the chronology of the TYJ boxes.

Well, that makes me feel a little better, especially today. I had a "planet spin" occur so now I'm even more medicated than usual, and as I've said before (usually in a joking manner, but this time in a literal sense): "I get confused enough on my own; I don't need any outside help." But what the heck? We're talking time travel here. How can you not get confused? (I have a feeling this is going to be a very short night on the Forum for me. )

I simply feel that there is something very odd going on here - and, as yet, we haven't got to the bottom of it. "Time will tell, it always does in the end"!  

And in that I think we are in total agreement, my friend!

Dino.

[fivefingeredstyre]

Proper Steve...

I like the idea of that 

[tony farrell]

So, does that mean Volpone is "Improper Steve"? 

[phillbarron]

Is it me or does the damage above the word PUBLIC in Domvar's photo:

I too had noticed the "stile" and "steps" I had always written this off as being these details were attached to the sign box and the variation is due to them moving these around, somewhere there is an image of the newbury box at longleet wearing a TYJ sign box on one side but I cant find a clear shot of it however I did find this:-



Could the sign have been taken out and turned upside down and then the sign box fitted the other way up causing the stile to appear?

if so it would suggest the steps were attached to the side panels and a separate piece altogether on the sides with doors?

Exactly match the damage above the same word in this photo?

Found this picture of items from the Bonhams auction in 1994. Maybe this explains the stiles...

Is that significant? If they are the same frame in the same orientation to the words but in the opposite orientation to the steps, does that mean ALL these bits are modular (or at least fell apart and were put back together in different ways)?

Is it possible the clip-over signs were molded from two different sides at the same time? One with the stile nubin and one without? And then just randomly stuck over every time the prop was assembled?

[fivefingeredstyre]

So, does that mean Volpone is "Improper Steve"? 

I'm sayin' nuffink...

[fivefingeredstyre]

Is it me or does the damage above the word PUBLIC in Domvar's photo:


Exactly match the damage above the same word in this photo?

id say they are the same sign box.

In all honesty I'm leaning towards the thinking that the front and back signboxes were always a single mounded unit, including the steps. I think the camera angle in the first picture is such that just we can't see them properly...

Because of the Tuassades frontage my gut instinct is that the stile was always there from the start, we just couldn't see it. Perhaps the roof section overlapped it?

Bearing in mind the changes to the lamp base around 82, maybe there was a whole new roof section made at some point, which was slightly smaller causing the upper stile be visible as the older roof covered them up?

[galacticprobe]

So, does that mean Volpone is "Improper Steve"?  

Good grief, Tony! Are you trying to get me in trouble? (On second thought... don't answer that. )

And 'Proper Steve'...

I'm sayin' nuffink...

...not helping!

Actually, going by the pattern in the original dialogue from "Silence In The Library", volpone is "Other Steve".

Dino.

[tony farrell]

So, does that mean Volpone is "Improper Steve"?  

Good grief, Tony! Are you trying to get me in trouble? (On second thought... don't answer that. )

You don't need my help to do that Dino!

Given that we all seem to disagree about the correct history (and construction) of the TYJ Boxes, I think the best way to proceed is for us to post screen grabs (and photos) of the prop in chronological order i.e., in the order in which the stories were recorded (not necessarily in the order they were transmitted). I've been out all day today, but if people can be patient, I'll start the 'ball rolling' tomorrow evening (UK time).

That way, people can judge for themselves. 

T

[galacticprobe]

Good grief, Tony! Are you trying to get me in trouble? (On second thought... don't answer that. )

You don't need my help to do that Dino!

OH! The wound! The wound! (Feel free to pull that knife out anytime now... )

Given that we all seem to disagree about the correct history (and construction) of the TYJ Boxes, I think the best way to proceed is for us to post screen grabs (and photos) of the prop in chronological order i.e., in the order in which the stories were recorded (not necessarily in the order they were transmitted). I've been out all day today, but if people can be patient, I'll start the 'ball rolling' tomorrow evening (UK time).

That way, people can judge for themselves.  

Outstanding plan, Tony! I think part of the problem is the fact that we have (at least) two TY-J boxes confirmed, and a Newbery that was modified to look like a TY-J box, and all three were used from 1980 until the last Classic episode in 1989. So maybe it would be a good idea to also put together a second chronological photo grab order showing the boxes as they appeared in their transmitted order once we've established their production order. That way could see just how often the boxes were interchanged. (That's just a thought: possibly an irrelevant one, but just a thought.)

Dino.

[tony farrell]

I think part of the problem is the fact that we have (at least) two TY-J boxes confirmed, and a Newbery that was modified to look like a TY-J box, and all three were used from 1980 until the last Classic episode in 1989. So maybe it would be a good idea to also put together a second chronological photo grab order showing the boxes as they appeared in their transmitted order once we've established their production order. That way could see just how often the boxes were interchanged.
Dino.

Clearly there is a time-lag between making a programme and transmitting that programme. This time-lag allows for flexibility in the scheduling (transmission) of the programme and - in the case of the 'additional stile' with which we began our current discussion - this scheduling flexibility could itself contribute to the 'now we see it, now we don't' problem.

Secondly, on the basis that you can't use a prop before you've actually built it, I think it would be wiser to stick with the order in which the actual serials were made.

T

[darren79]

The (sort of) easy one first:

Have we ever noticed those little squares at the bottom of the side walls before..?

Probably not, or someone would have mentioned them. (Good eyes, Steve!) Looking back through all of the reference images that we have for the TY-J box, they're not there in "Logopolis", or in any of the Davison era images or publicity photos (depending on which box they used: the mark I or mark II). They are there in McCoy's "Silver Nemesis". No good reference images for the Colin Baker era showing the side (at least not that side), and I can't find any good images for McCoy prior to "Silver Nemesis". Not a lot of help, but it at least narrows down the timeframe for when those square things appeared on the box.

They're there in Delta and the Bannermen.

http://tardisbuilders.com/index.php?action=dlattach;k=894;topic=966.0;attach=82093;image

[galacticprobe]

I lightened the image up, but I don't see those little squares in it:



Darren, could you maybe please highlight them for us?

Dino.

[tony farrell]

Here you go!



T

[galacticprobe]

Wow! You really do have to lighten this image up some in order to see that!

I know my stanky old wizzard eyes are pretty bad at times, but I'm really starting to worry now if I have to lighten an image that much just so I can see what everyone else can see on the original image.

Thanks, Tony! That narrows it down even more. (Any good earlier story images that might show those squares?)

Dino.

[tony farrell]

I refer the honourable gentleman to this thread:  http://tardisbuilders.com/index.php?topic=6858.msg85550#msg85550

As of today's date, we just haven't got quite that far! 

T