Logopolis

[Scarfwearer]

If I'm understanding this right, the prop research by Anthony Sibley on the TARDIS Library supports what domvar is saying:

http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/~trekker/policeboxes/tv3.html#s19

This new TARDIS prop also had two sets of inward opening doors, front and rear and the decision was taken to hang them so that on one side, the right door would open first and the opposing side, the left door would open first - giving them the option to choose which fascia to favour. As it happened, the "left door" side was favoured throughout this and the next season. Because of this, the phone panel (white lettering on a blue background with the correct "Urgent Calls" wording) was not a permanent fixture, it was held in place with double sided tape which meant that they could affix it to whichever side they were recording with.

In terms of handles and locks, on the "left opening" side, the lock was positioned on the right vertical stile of the door, half way up the phone panel, a handle was also attached to the phone panel's framework to allow the actors to close this door, and at the same level, another handle was affixed to the centre divide. On the opposing "right opening" fascia, the lock position was reversed; on the stile to the right of the centre divide (now without a handle) and placed half way up the panel below the window. A door handle was attached below the lock here.

(my bold)

We're not seeing a third box or a box modified during production, apparently. We're simply seeing the front and back of the same TYJ prop with the front and back locks in their permanently different positions, and the Newbery box being used as the other police box.

I must say that having the TYJ front and rear doors open differently was a great idea, but having the locks in different positions was clearly going to be an ongoing continuity problem...

Crispin

[davidnagel]

Ya know, I had never noticed the lock change across scenes... d'oh

[meantimebob]

This is all very interesting but take a look at the windows on those doors, they're the same in both cases, just look at those distinctive white smudges on the panes. Whatever jiggery pokery happened with the doors, didn't happen to the windows, they remained constant.

[DoctorWho8]

But the TYJ was using the left hand door to open throughout Season 18-19.  It didn't get switched around until Season 20 after a refurb.  We are seeing the modified Newbury from it's first scene in it's normal door configuration and then it's changed door configuration after the TYJ TARDIS prop shows up in the materialization scene.  It's the same doors as before as you can tell by the window trim and the bevels on the doors.  The door swap with the TYJ formers didn't happen until Peter Davison's time in Castrovalva.  Is this helping to make better sense?
Bill "the Doctor" Rudloff

[warmcanofcoke]

This is all very interesting but take a look at the windows on those doors, they're the same in both cases, just look at those distinctive white smudges on the panes. Whatever jiggery pokery happened with the doors, didn't happen to the windows, they remained constant.

it looks very similar I grant you. but if the box was painted to look worn out looking they could have repeated the white smudges and dark window crack on the side of the box on the other side. or I have bad captures....

[Rassilons Rod]

We're not seeing a third box or a box modified during production, apparently.

Crispin, I agree with the bit I bolded, but if you check out the screen grabs, it's clearly the Newberry box that is posing as a genuine police box (and subsequently both the Master's and the Doctor's TARDISes in the same place) - and you can see from the screen grabs that the lock moves from right door to left door.

You can see it's the same because the Newberry has a frame around the doors and no 3 step lintel.

The TYJ only appears at the layby on the sliproad, the box on the verge is always the Newberry.

---------

My theory about using two sets of doors is just a theory I cannot prove it with this level of detail in the screen grabs. I just think it would have been a lot easier than moving the lock whilst on location.

[domvar]

Lock not moved just on different side on front doors to back doors on tyj box

[warmcanofcoke]

looks like a lot of people will be watching Logopolis tonight on DVD

[Rassilons Rod]

It's not the TYJ though... it has a frame around the doors - and no three-step lintel.

The TYJ doesn't have a frame around the doors... Just look at the grabs above, and this one.

Also, the signs are still the old type on the modified Newberry - the TYJ signs have the thinner trim on their sides.

[DoctorWho8]

Hopefully this can help put to rest the discussion.

Example 1) an overlay of the officer using the phone and the Doctor coming out the TARDIS.  Notice the white smudge in the top center window pane is identical.  Also note, the Newbury always had 2 steps under the top sign (at least on the door side for sure).  You never could see them because they were always in shadow due to the lighting.


Example 2)
The left hand door from 3 different points in the filming.  The left is the opening shot, the middle is towards the end of the console room scenes, and the right is somewhere in between.  All three have the same characteristics with the windows, trim and bevels.


Example 3)
When you watch the filmed segments, the one with the officer are a bit on the dark side, so they ended up lighting from the front (hence why you can see the two steps under the top sign).  During the Tegan and Aunty Vanessa scenes, it gets much lighter.  It would have meant they filmed early in the morning just when the sun was rising when the first scene was filmed.  Then they would have had to stop for a while because of early morning traffic, which would have interfered with sound recording.  There would have been at least a couple of hours between the officer scene and the Tegan and Auntie Vanessa scenes for them to have modified the Newbury doors for when the TYJ was brought out for the materialization scene.

I rest my case.
Bill "the Doctor" Rudloff

[Rassilons Rod]

Thanks for agreeing with me that it's the Newberry box Bill

But why drag carpenters out on location, it sounds unreasonably expensive to me...

Ok, so the left one is the copper on the phone, and the right one is probably inside the TARDIS with the phone dangling. And the middle one?

[Rassilons Rod]

This would seem to confirm the carpentry theory though... It's not clear but you can JUST see something a little different to the surrounding paintwork where the old lock would have been. I still think it's strange to go to that expense though...

Left is the copper, right is Tegan reading the phone panel.

[DoctorWho8]

The middle one is a studio shot of Tegan in the console room with the Newbury prop.  In the actual scene it dematerializes before she comes in, but the sign door is close by the Doctor prior to entering.

About the prop mods on the scene of recording, they would have had at least a couple of prop guys on hand since they wheeled out 2 TARDIS props that would have needed assembly on site.  So it stands to reason those same prop guys would have been able to do the mods on the Newbury doors when there was a sizable break in filming.  This would have been planned beforehand rather than spur of the moment, I would think.
Bill "the Doctor" Rudloff

[DoctorWho8]

Oh and they also dirtied up the phone panel, probably so it wouldn't look as different to the TYJ door sign.  I honestly think they kept the Newbury doors unmodified for the officer's scene to show they opened differently from the TARDIS' doors.  Irony is, they still had the right door used to go in and out often because of the added phone box behind the sign door, so the center divider ended up behind the left hand door.  It wasn't until Tegan and Aunty Vanessa went into the TARDIS that they went in the left door.  I just rewatched Part 1, so it's quite fresh in my mind.
Bill "the Doctor" Rudloff

[Rassilons Rod]

By the end of the scene it's the Master's TARDIS though, but the copper still gets pulled in through the right hand door...

</continuity nerd>