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Moving time rotor tutorial?

Started by wayne venomous, Aug 17, 2011, 09:03 pm

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wayne venomous

Aug 17, 2011, 09:03 pm Last Edit: Aug 17, 2011, 09:05 pm by wayne venomous
I was wondering if it would be useful if I did a tutorial on powering up a car wiper motor in order to make a time rotor move up and down?

Here's a video I did for something else showing different wiper motor speeds on an old VW Beetle wiper motor:

I can certainly do something more focused towards time rotor building.

The thing is, if you wire it correctly it will return to it's "parked" position like it's supposed to when it's fitted to the car thus the time rotor will always stop in the correct place. These can be powered very easily using a 12 volt transformer (sometimes called a camping transformer) basically it allows you to power 12 volt items from the mains electrical supply. Think I paid about £6 for mine.

The choice of using VW Beetle (the old air cooled type, not the new type) was mainly because I've got a few lying around but I'm also thinking they were sold all around the world so the chances of finding one in a junk yard are pretty high, plus they're easy to remove and even a quick search on Ebay brings up about 10 of them!

Scarfwearer

Aug 17, 2011, 09:40 pm #1 Last Edit: Aug 17, 2011, 09:40 pm by Scarfwearer
That would be very helpful! I've been getting nearer to picking up a wiper motor to power my time rotor so I'd be first in line to read it!

Crispin

celation

Yes please, Wayne! That would be excellent!  :D

type55tardis

Aug 18, 2011, 05:22 am #3 Last Edit: Aug 18, 2011, 05:46 am by type55tardis
Hi Wayne, good article,
If you look at my original console regeneration post(the one with the black console) in console build diary's,you will see my adaptation of a Mk2 Mondeo wiper motor fitted into a frame,with the use of a variable power supply,dropped down to 9v,i was able to operate it at a reasonable speed,the use of heavy duty drawer slides enabled the up and down motion,I used the original arm off the motor as part of the construction and it appears to work quite well,but there is a slight wobble on the up sweep caused by the weight of the column, and the stability of the drawer slides,I would be interested in seeing how your construct goes and would love to see any ideas on improvements you may have,and if we get our heads together we may be able to come up with a reliable and cheap raise lower mechanism that other members could use ( because everyone wants their central column to move :))I was unable to use the self parking mechanism on the motor,as it appears that on the Mondeo it is external to the motor,but I would imagine it would be a nightmare to line it up correctly.

Here's a couple of pics of the measurements

front view measure.JPG




top view measure.JPG

Anyway best of luck with your trials,

Peter.
so let me get this straight,A thing that looks like a Police box standing in a junkyard,It can move anywhere in Time and space ?

davidnagel

Wayne, a tutorial for motionising our rotors would be a fantastic idea.

I have an old wiper motor that I should really pull out and work out how to get powered. If I take a picture, can someone advise on how to wire it up? It doesn't look very normal... (as per your Beetle one for example)
Kind Regards,

David

www.spiffinglyniceguy.co.uk

wayne venomous

Aug 18, 2011, 09:19 pm #5 Last Edit: Aug 18, 2011, 09:28 pm by wayne venomous
I'll probably concentrate on the electrical side first, then move onto the runners and actual mechanism that attaches to the motor.

Peter, interesting note on the variable power supply. I know there's a variable resistor specifically for reducing 12 volts to lower voltages. I'll see I can dig out a diagram for this or at least find out if there's a specific part which works best.

Here's a wiring diagram which allows you to get the Beetle wiper motor up and running without using the original switch:
Wiperdiagram2.jpg
I've seen both individually marked terminals and trailing wires on similarly aged cars, but this should cover most variations.
You could use the original switch as some models had the switch mounted on the dashboard but the vast majority of them (particularly 1970's models) had the switch mounted in the steering column which is a pain to remove and pretty difficult to install in anything other than a steering column.

It's worth noting that any wiper motor with terminals marked "54" instead of a "53" denotes it's a 6 volt unit instead of a 12 volt unit, and although will still work it will be far too fast for this. I'm not sure but I think the codes on here aren't just limited to VW Beetles but are German DIN standards so most German cars should have the same or similarly marked terminals or wires. I'll check this though.

The rotary switch is this type:
rotaryswitch.jpg


And the relays are the standard 4 blade automotive type (sometimes referred to as a Bosch relay, although they're made by other manufacturers)

BoschRelay.jpg

wayne venomous

Quote from: davidnagel on Aug 18, 2011, 12:08 pm
Wayne, a tutorial for motionising our rotors would be a fantastic idea.

I have an old wiper motor that I should really pull out and work out how to get powered. If I take a picture, can someone advise on how to wire it up? It doesn't look very normal... (as per your Beetle one for example)

Do you know what vehicle it's from? Also if the terminals have any markings or letters/numbers that could help.

davidnagel

Aug 18, 2011, 10:02 pm #7 Last Edit: Aug 18, 2011, 10:03 pm by davidnagel
Quote from: wayne venomous on Aug 18, 2011, 09:29 pm
Do you know what vehicle it's from? Also if the terminals have any markings or letters/numbers that could help.


I do believe the motor is a rear wiper motor from a Ford fiesta but I'm not 100 percent sure on that one... here is a picture for your advice!
th_DSC00318.jpg

There are no markings except serial numbers...
Kind Regards,

David

www.spiffinglyniceguy.co.uk

type55tardis

Aug 19, 2011, 06:58 am #8 Last Edit: Aug 19, 2011, 07:12 am by type55tardis
Rear wiper motor, that's interesting, as they don`t have a wiper arm assembly,thus the motor does the wipe action (IE: the up and down motion) I don`t know if they are as strong as the motors that do the double wipe on the windscreen,of course the hardest part is attaching an arm or flywheel or other device to get the lifting action,I`m currently upgrading my raise lower lift ,when it was built it was designed to raise and lower the gubbins inside the glass column,now its raising the whole thing and I feel that this is whats causing the unsteadiness,I think the narrowness of the old base plate is causing the whole thing to become top heavy and give a slight wobble,and its a pain to get level.
So I'm broadening the dimensions of the lift to give it stability,I'm going from 25cm square with a round base plate to 36cm square with a square base plate this should mean that the lift should be a lot more steady,the column or whatever is loaded on to the lift will be relatively free standing and central on the base plate,I think after looking at the exhibition console there may be a case for counter weights to give the motor a bit of help on the up sweep,anyhow there's my 2 cents for now I'll let you know how I get on.
I originally decided to make the base 40cm x 40cm and guess what,it was to big to go into the base of the console >:(   always remember measure about 15 times and cut once  :) .
Also if you need to lower the voltage from a power supply DON'T buy the voltage regulator switch from Maplins (costs about £14.00) as I bought one and it makes a horrible whistling sound if you adjust the variable resistor below full power and it burnt out pretty quickly ,even though it was supposed to have a range of up to 5amps and my motor runs at between 2.5 and 4.5 amps,if anyone wants advice on this problem don`t hesitate to ask as I've had about 2 years experience on this and I can at least tell you what not to try  :).
so let me get this straight,A thing that looks like a Police box standing in a junkyard,It can move anywhere in Time and space ?

wayne venomous

Quote from: davidnagel on Aug 18, 2011, 10:02 pm
Quote from: wayne venomous on Aug 18, 2011, 09:29 pm
Do you know what vehicle it's from? Also if the terminals have any markings or letters/numbers that could help.


I do believe the motor is a rear wiper motor from a Ford fiesta but I'm not 100 percent sure on that one... here is a picture for your advice!
th_DSC00318.jpg

There are no markings except serial numbers...

Only appears to have two wires so:
Brown = Negative
Black = +12 volts
I'm presuming the small collection of capacitors is the circuit to allow it to park.

As Peter type55tardis has said, it doesn't have the lever to allow it to move up and down, however you could try a cut-down wiper arm and drill a hole in the end. Not sure how strong this would be though, you might have to strengthen it.

davidnagel

Thanks for your info guys.  There is a thread on the end of the shaft which I will attach an arm. I hope to counterweight it so there is no strain on the motor other than the movement.
Kind Regards,

David

www.spiffinglyniceguy.co.uk

type55tardis

I've just purchased a new mains operated motor for my console,as intend to improve the R/L lift.
It operates at 30rpm and has a gearbox attached, it cost £80.00 inc carriage and there is a link to it in my console regen topic,the only problem I'm having at the moment is working out how to attach an arm or flywheel to the drive shaft. any ideas guys ?.

Here is the motor

motor1.JPG                       motor 2.JPG

Its pretty compact and very powerful.
so let me get this straight,A thing that looks like a Police box standing in a junkyard,It can move anywhere in Time and space ?

wayne venomous

That looks a very interesting motor!

Have you tried the manufacturer themselves to see what attachments (gears/pulleys etc) they sell for their motors?

davidnagel

Nice motor Type55

By the way Type, what can you advise to use to power my motor? I have an old 9 or 12v bolt that I need to charge - I assume that would be safer to use in the meantime until I can find a mains adapter...
Kind Regards,

David

www.spiffinglyniceguy.co.uk

wayne venomous

This is what I use (and what's powering the VW Beetle wiper motor in the video above)
203442_lrg.jpg
http://www.outdoorworld.co.uk/universal-240v-12v-transformer

They are available much cheaper than that though, I think I paid about £6 for mine at a local caravan shop.