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V20 Castelnau & Ferry Road Box

Started by hb88banzai, Oct 31, 2012, 09:47 am

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hb88banzai

Oct 31, 2012, 09:47 am Last Edit: Oct 31, 2012, 09:53 am by hb88banzai
The Box at the junction of Castelnau & Ferry Road in Barnes - V20

Photo circa 1965 --Castelnau-Ferry_Road_Box-V20-(c1965).JPG

A blowup --

Castelnau-Ferry_Road_Box-V20-(c1965)-Blowup.JPG

Note that by 1965 the original "Richmond" Timber Box had been replaced by a Mark 3. Of course it is also listed as "Resited" in the Met List, so it's anybody's guess as to where the original Box was located - could have been a few feet away, across the street, or even on another block or street.

Approximate POV street view --

Castelnau-Ferry_Road_Box-V20-ApproxPOV_Streetview.JPG

Closer view of the Box's corner showing the corner building behind it is still there --

Castelnau-Ferry_Road_Box-V20-CornerStreetview.JPG

As are the rest of the buildings down the block --

Castelnau-Ferry_Road_Box-V20-BuildingsStreetview.JPG

Box Site street view --

Castelnau-Ferry_Road_Box-V20-SiteStreetview.JPG

Box Site Street View URL:  http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Ferry+Road,+Barnes,+London,+UK&hl=en&ll=51.475844,-0.239135&spn=0.000013,0.00839&sll=51.486601,-0.232054&sspn=0.003788,0.00839&oq=Ferry+Road,+B,+london+uk&hnear=Ferry+Rd,+London+Borough+of+Richmond+upon+Thames,+London+SW13,+United+Kingdom&t=m&z=17&layer=c&cbll=51.475698,-0.239169&panoid=J7TUj-7_UkHhgzN7B3fJqw&cbp=12,317.11,,1,7.05


hb88banzai

Feb 15, 2013, 06:08 pm #1 Last Edit: Feb 15, 2013, 06:14 pm by hb88banzai
Another photo finally recognized as being this Box (thanks Pete and Mark) --

Castelnau-Ferry_Road_Box-V20-Pic2.jpg

Current street view --

Castelnau-Ferry_Road_Box-V20-Pic2-StreetView.JPG

hb88banzai

Feb 15, 2013, 06:12 pm #2 Last Edit: Feb 15, 2013, 06:27 pm by hb88banzai
OK, now I really feel bad for not only missing that this was V20, but that this photo is of the original - a Timber Box!

A blowup --

Castelnau-Ferry_Road_Box-V20-Pic2-Blowup.JPG

Upgraded, but the roof line and sign boxes are unmistakable. Wish we had a date. The top signs having white letters with blue backgrounds would place it Fall/Winter of 1937 or later if my theorized chronology is correct.

The posted copy of the 1965 photo is too blurry to be absolutely certain, but it looks to me like a Mark 3 replacement.

Mark

It certainly looks as though it could be the last style of police box because there doesn't seem to be anything panel wise, just a shiny wall. Agreed it may to to fuzzy to 100%.

Interesting but also a little sad to see the progression and updating of the phone box and bus shelter through the years but no modern day police box to go with it.

Volpone

Feb 17, 2013, 04:57 pm #4 Last Edit: Feb 19, 2013, 04:41 pm by volpone
Quote from: hb88banzai on Feb 15, 2013, 06:12 pm
... the roof line and sign boxes are unmistakable. ...

Most of you guys have a better eye for this stuff than I do.  I'm amazed by the discussion of 5 tumbler -vs- 6 tumbler Yale keys over in the main forum.  Can you expand on what about the roof line says this is a timber box to you?  

To my eye it appears to have less aggressive steps and a flatter slope to the roof--making it more like the "Doctor Who" props than the traditional concrete Met boxes.  Is this the case?  

If you or Pete or anyone feels like it I'd be interested in seeing a guide to the Met boxes put together (with circles and arrows and such on important details, like the discussion of handle screw holes for the Brachaki prop).  Apart from that, keep up the good work!

[Edited to respond to the comments below:  Thanks!  Now that you mention it, I see what you mean about the stacks being pushed in from the sides.  Looks like the "capitals" on top of the corner posts aren't as pronounced either (although that could be just the angle/resolution of the photo.)]
"My dear Litefoot, I've got a lantern and a pair of waders, and possibly the most fearsome piece of hand artillery in all England. What could possibly go wrong?"
-The Doctor.

hb88banzai

Yes, the roof stacking is lower and starts much further in from the pillars than any other type of Police Box. If you look at the top sign boxes you will also see that they are very flat/thin, only narrowly coming proud of the pillars, with a frame around the signage itself and tell-tale weather flashing drooping down from the top of each sign box.

I've been thinking for quite awhile that we need to do up a spotters guide, but it is only recently that we've had a critical mass reached on number and quality of photos (tied to specific boxes and with reasonable dates) that would make this practical. In the near future Box Type and Yale Key guides will be worked up and posted for reference.

hb88banzai

Mar 08, 2013, 07:23 am #6 Last Edit: Mar 08, 2013, 07:27 am by hb88banzai
Found a great new photo of this Box from when it was actually first being Sited.

From 1929 --

Castelnau-Ferry_Road_Box-V20-(1929).JPG

The caption for the photo reads, "The new police telephone-box and temporary cell in one, London, 01 January 1929"

Date is partially bogus (these photo sites often use arbitrary day and month when specifics weren't available). I'd say this was shot some time in the Fall while the Box was being sited as it is missing it's globe Beacon. Very reminiscent of the early photo of the Bowes Road Box (Y10).

This is just the low-res sample, but hi-res prints are available. Source:  http://www.topfoto.co.uk/imageflows/preview/t=topfoto&f=0145959

petewilson

TWO excellent Finds banzai...
See the price this company is charging for one print!!!
It make's Francis Frith look good!  ;D

Pete

chriskingbees

Brilliant picture, a K1 Mark 235, too

KB

hb88banzai

They do make a glorious pair, don't they.

Yes, the price is high, but if you've ever checked on trying to get a (digital) copy of photos at places like Mary Evans or Ghetty Images where they are geared towards editorial/publishing rights, even these seem like quite the bargain.


petewilson

Feb 12, 2017, 09:52 am #10 Last Edit: Feb 12, 2017, 09:52 am by petewilson
Here's a Hi-Res version of the original Frith Photo...


V20 Castelnau - Ferry Road, Barnes Hi-Res.jpg

Volpone

Feb 12, 2017, 05:37 pm #11 Last Edit: Feb 12, 2017, 05:39 pm by volpone
I can't tell at that resolution, but it almost looks like a Mk V to me, or am I imagining things?  No, just my imagination, I think. 
"My dear Litefoot, I've got a lantern and a pair of waders, and possibly the most fearsome piece of hand artillery in all England. What could possibly go wrong?"
-The Doctor.

bfg1981


Teppic

I concur. The gap between the sign boxes and the windows appears to be too small for it to be anything other than a Mark 5.

hb88banzai

Apr 17, 2017, 12:06 pm #14 Last Edit: Apr 17, 2017, 12:26 pm by hb88banzai
Oh, it's definitely a Mark 5, through and through. Here's a blowup to make it more obvious --

V20 Castelnau - Ferry Road, Barnes Hi-Res--Blowup.JPG

And then, for the opposite end of the spectrum, there's this Press Photo of the original Mark 1, dated as being from 08 August 1929 --

V20--Castelnau & Ferry Road Box - Press Photo (08 Aug 1929)-Front.png

(Note that I also own this particular Press Photo, so a hi-res (and non-watermarked) version will eventually be forthcoming.)

Here's the caption on the back --

V20--Castelnau & Ferry Road Box - Press Photo (08 Aug 1929)-Back.png

From the date it was most likely very shortly after this Box was erected (note the top Beacon has yet to be installed). Now, the very weird bit is that this caption says "A series of 15 police boxes are being erected in the suburbs around London..." Very, very odd, as from even before the first two prototypes were erected in Becontree/Dagnham in December 1928 the go-ahead had been given from the Home Office to mount a full scale experimental installation in both Richmond and Wood Green with an anticipated 40+ Boxes, and at this point most were in the process of being sited or in final negotiations for the right to do so.

A mere 15 Boxes wouldn't even cover the number for Richmond, which was at least up to 20 at the time. I know from memos that the last one or two were uncertain until the last minute (negotiations in Richmond proved to be problematic), but the Beat Book printed in November of 1929 lists all 22, though one seems to be described as being in the wrong position based on documents Mike Knight has (V22, which seems to have always been a little to the north of the listed location).

V Div-Richmond SubDiv-Box List Nov-1929 (11-29 print code).JPG